16

D.: If one is to withdraw oneself, why is there the world?

M.: Where is the world and where does one go withdrawing oneself?

Does one fly in an aeroplane beyond space? Is it withdrawal?

The fact is this: the world is only an idea. What do you say: Are you within the world or is the world within you?

D.: I am in the world. I am part of it.

M.: That is the mistake. If the world were to exist apart from you, does  it come and tell you that it exists? 

No, you see it exists. You see it  when you are awake and not when asleep. 

If it exists apart from you,  it must tell you so and you must be aware of it even in your sleep.

D.: I became aware of it in my jagrat.

M.: Do you become aware of yourself and then of the world? 

Or do  you become aware of the world and then of yourself? 

Or do you  become aware of both simultaneously?

D.: I must say simultaneously.

M.: Were you or were you not, before becoming aware of yourself? 

Do  you admit your continued existence before and when you become  aware of the world?

D.: Yes.

M.: If always existing yourself, why are you not aware of the world  in sleep if it exists apart from the Self?

D.: I become aware of myself and of the world also.

M.: So you become aware of yourself. Who becomes aware of whom?

Are there two selves?

D.: No.

M.: So you see that it is wrong to suppose that awareness has passing phases. The Self is always aware. When the Self identifies itself as  the seer it sees objects. The creation of the subject and the object is  the creation of the world. 

Subjects and objects are creations in Pure

Consciousness. You see pictures moving on the screen in a cinema  show. When you are intent on the pictures you are not aware of the  screen. But the pictures cannot be seen without the screen behind.

The world stands for the pictures and Consciousness stands for  the screen. 

The Consciousness is pure. 

It is the same as the Self  which is eternal and unchanging. 

Get rid of the subject and object

and Pure Consciousness will alone remain.

~ Talks with Sri Ramana Maharishi, #453